" Shame, what possible good does it do to let these idiots out while they are still drunk? Judges in some counties require a sober release. "

" "technical, constitutional and fiscal concerns". Meaningless rhetoric from gutless politicians. I wouldn't be surprised if they set out to save the Wyoming heritage and tradition of drinking and driving. "

" " There are many posts of significance triggered by this incident logged under the CST article (01/10/08) "Officials seek law to keep drunk driving suspects in jail" Place the word “sandbar” in the search box, hit search and it will take you many articles written relating to this incident, Find other stories by using the words "Irene", "Pagal", and "Benton". " "

" In my opinion I think that you should keep the idiots in jail until they are sober enough to walk a stright line and then they can get out of jail but it is your choice to do so but we have a lot of people that in evanston that are drunk and drive and ya but like i said it is your chioce "

" Tom,

The Natrona County Sheriff just needs to change his jail policy.

We simply need to ask him when he plans to get that done.

Shame on him for not doing so long ago.

What's his excuse going to be the next time a tragic incident occurs involving a intoxicated suspect bailed out early? "

" This is what happens when people elect LAWYERS to be their governor, senators, and representatives. Lawyers care ONLY for their own profession. They care NOTHING about the people they were elected to represent, regardless of political party. When you are unhappy about a good bill like this going down in flames, look at the lawyers in the legislature. They are usually the ones behind the failure, as was the case with this bill. "

" Don’t Use Initiative (DUI). Inertia from elected officials at several levels has prevailed and failed the citizens of Wyoming. And again the Natrona County Sheriff seems to have slid through and come out unscathed with nothing being done to correct the jail release problem of suspected DUI drivers. Perhaps the sheriff has an ostrich like capability to problems by refusing to face them. Good luck to pedestrians in Natrona County. "

" I would have liked to see this bill pass, however, regardless of forcing someone to stay in jail until they are sober does not mean they are not going to go out and drink again. This is one situation that no law can gain complete control of. I do not wish to see anyone harmed by the irresponsible decisions of drunk drivers. "

" Oh man , MADD sure wont like this. If they let the drunks out , they could get some more revenue . Easy pickings. Now if they would just go after those cell phone users.......... "

" This is truly saddening. What is wrong with our legislature? Did they not take the time or bother to even look into how other states are initiating an 8 hour hold on drunks in order for them to 'sober up' before being released back into the public. If they had done so they might have found that the effectiveness of the 'hold' has resulted in an increase of public safety. They really dropped the ball on this one! "

" I strongly disagree with the committee! If we can't make it law, every judge should make it policy. "

" Since most jails already hold DUI arrests for 12 hours, or until they "blow 0's" whats the big deal? Many times, the bond money must come from out of town, meaning who ever brought the money to get them out has to stay overnight (flophouse anyone?) waiting for ridiculous "winning numbers" from the jailed person. Wouldn't it be courteous to allow them to take the person to another town for the night, instead of us paying to house them for 12 hours or whatever? I feel like MADD, SADD, and other such acronyms are already running our state govenments. Seeing them get their hands slapped for a change is nice.
If the citizens of Casper really feel this is something that should be changed, they need to pressure their own sheriff, or chief of police, into taking action with jail policy, instead of forcing more laws on the rest of the state. Oh yeah, I forgot, law enforcement officers don't take kindly to outside suggestions. Ooops! "

" Like I said in previous posts to related stories this is a policy issue not an issue for the law makers. The Sheriff must want or needs guidance from the state statutes to make a decision. A bill worth presenters to the law makers would include higher bond amounts, stiffer fines, more use of the ignition interlock, a better implied consent law, and other ways to get the attention of the drunk driver. On average a person drives drunk 7 times before they are caught and there are way more drunks on the road than cops after midnight. What we need is a decisive leader not someone willing to pass the buck and only willing to do the minimun amount of work because the statutes say so. "

" The legislature had some concerns with the bill, particularly:
If it is illegal to drive at .08, but completely legal to drive or be out on the streets at .079, how is it legal to keep people in jail until .000 is reached.
Another concern: No one can be compelled to blow in the first place, so if they refuse to blow in the first place, how can you force them to blow to be released? IE, forcing them to blow would be forcing them to incriminate themselves. Could a forced sample from the Intoxiler be used against them in court, in violation of their 5th amend rights?
ho hum..
"

" Spoken like a true LAWYER, TomT. Congratulations. Your double-talk will allow more drunks to run over innocent people after they are released from jail WHILE STILL DRUNK! But hey, maybe they'll hire YOU to defend them! Think about all the money you'll make! Whoopee! "

" Well TomT is not a lawyer or knowledgeble on this issue and this is why. A lawyer would know that a PBT (portabel breath test) is not accepted by the courts as a "test" to determine the quantity of alcohol in ones blood. Yet a PBT would be sufficient enough to determine if the person is sober enough to leave the jail. The intoximeter used for the implied consent test after a person is arrested is a much more accurate machine recognized as a test in courts. Also TomT is wrong about blowing a .079% BAC and being legal to drive. A person is considered to "not" be under the infuence of alcohol with a .049% BAC or less. A person is considered to be intoxicated by a court of law if he/she is a .08% BAC or greater. Between .05% and .08% it is up to the officer's observations and totality of the circumstances, through his/her field sobriety maneuvers to determine if the driver is too impaired to be driving. All that said with the assumption the person is at least 21 yrs old. All things change for persons under 21. Besides all of the above, there are VERY FEW people arrested who are "on the line" of .08%. Most people arrested in Natrona County are around double the legal limit or greater. "

" TomT: I don't know about WY (never gotten pulled over here), but in UT, it's not perfectly legal to drive, even if you're under .08. I got pulled over in UT, my car got impounded, I was arrested and taken to the police station (in that order). There, I was given a breathalizer, and I blew .06. In UT, that still constitutes drunk driving, cause the cops opinion is worth more then the machines...
It would be arbitrary and expensive to keep people in prison until they're totally sober, when the ones that get away will drive to work the next morning, still drunk! "

" Carmen, you give me far too much credit. I'm sitting on the sidelines, just like you. The main difference in you and I is, I paraphrased what they decided from a constituional standpoint to HELP you understand, but your reaction is that of a 5 year old child, who only WANTS but does not understand when mommy and daddy dont' GIVE.
So according to you, Carmen, it's okay to arrest people, violate their 4th and the 5th AMENDMENTS rights under the Constitution in the good name of releasing them from jail sober? Perhaps we should suspend the entire constutiion..Should we start torturing or raping arrestees to get their confessions? Perhaps seize their houses and bank accounts without due process? Oh yeah!! We can suspend the Bill of Rights too!! Once people like you justify violating other people's rights for a "good cause" who knows where it ends? In the old days it was known as mob mentality, or lynch mobs. Nowdays, it's people like the legislature or people like me who have to do the reasonable thinking for people like you...
There is a solution to this problem. Don't give up just because the legislature didnt' accept the first unrefined idea. Be creative and think!! "

" Anonymous... the reason I used the intoxilizer for my example is because EVERYONE including the Chief and the Sheriff are asking for the .02 breath limit for a pre-custodial release. Nowhere in the public domain have they mentioned using a PBT as a pre-release tool. Nowhere. So for you to pop up on radar showing off your Intoxilizer vocabulary (I'm certified on it also) is pointless, when the real debate is: What is the best way to release drunks from jail, and how do we get that to happen? You are showing knowledge in your data, but not intelligence, which are two separate things.
Solve the puzzle of how to best solve this problem. "

" Unlike you, TomT, I have absolute zero-tolerance for drunk drivers and the people who coddle them.

I did get a chuckle from your accusation that I was behaving like a 5 year old right before you went into the most immature, irrational tirade I have ever read on this blog. Thanks for the laugh! "

" carmen , what,s your take on fools who drive around with a cell phone glued to thier mouth ? These jerks , male & females both , are just as dangerous as any drunk driver. And the media isfinally letting out news about how studies have proved this. "

" “Sheriff Benton now that Senate Bill 59 has failed, other than more lip service, just what is your and Chief Pagel’s next plan of action relative to the Natrona County Detention Centers' early release of un-sober intoxicated suspects?

In not immediately changing the the current intoxicated suspect bail out policy, it became very obvious that the two of you have lost total sight of the fact that you were sworn to “Protect and Serve” the rights of the Publics’ Safety?

As a reminder of selected details that triggered your last ditch effort to request filing of Senate Bill 59, please find the following reprint of my post logged under CST article (01/10/08) “Officials seek law to keep drunk driving suspects in jail”.

" It's now been 31 days since the Downs / Irene incident took place and still no press releases from Sheriff Benton as to any changes to his ridiculous NCDC bail out policy that allows un-sober suspects back out into the public mainstream.

I'm guessing he's been advised by the Natrona County Attorney to not change the current NCDC policy because it would indicate admission of second party liability in the referenced incident. As I see it, due to the NCDC un-sober bail out policy in place at the time of the referenced incident, the NCDC automatically became a second party to the referenced incident when they allowed Downs to be turn over to the third party (the Bondsman) for release.

Sadly for all those involved, what has happened in the Downs / Irene incident has happened and unfortunately we cannot roll back time. Continued failure to not immediately change the NCDC un-sober bail out policy, has left the same door wide open to exposure of more possible ugly (bodily injury and or death) incidents in the future. Only the good Lord knows who the next poor victim in line might be.

While we're on the Downs / Irene incident, I don't believe anyone has asked the following questions about the NCDC, Downs and the Bondsman. What did the NCDC staff estimate Downs BAC level to be at the time of his release the first time? Was it in the .08 range? Did the NCDC staff visually observe and note that Downs appeared to be sober enough to possibly meet the BAC .08 level range before his release? What would Downs estimated BAC level have been at the time he departed from the Bondsman? Was it possible that Downs BAC level was .08 or lower when he departed from the Bondsman? Did Downs possibly refuse a ride home offered by the Bondsman and choose to walk to a destination unknown to the Bondsman? At what specific time did Downs depart from the Bondsman? At what specific time did Downs blow the alleged second BAC level of .11? Did any of these questions come up after the initial investigation and were some of them the reason Downs second Hearing was postponed?

Benton's persistent refusal to change the NCDC policy continues to hold all visitors and or residents of Natrona County hostage to a very dangerous game of "Russian Roulette". He justifies his lack of action on possible inmate rights violations but he's not really sure? Give me a break. Let's tell it like it is, pure and simple, he just got caught with his draws down.

Why in the heck would is he more concerned about inmates' rights, than about protecting peoples public safety and local homeland security? How in the world is he going to justify his decision if some poor soul(s) suffer bodily injury or perish(es) at the hands of another un-sober suspect that has been released from the NCDC prematurely?

It doesn't take rocket science to figure out as to why last weeks abruptly called meeting (1/23/08) held in Casper to discuss alcohol laws, bond schedules and fourth amendment rights was all about. With the predicament that Benton has placed himself in and all the embarrassment he has caused, I'm guessing that representatives for the "Wyoming Association of Sheriff's and Chiefs of Police" from all 23 Wyoming Counties were promptly summoned to the meeting.

From the outside, it appears that the primary objective coming out of that meeting is a smoke and mirrors last minute "Hail Mary" effort to come up with a short term band-aid Bill to be jammed into this year's session in an crap shoot attempt to get the Bill passed with the necessary language in it to get Sheriff Benton off the hook. I’ll bet the farm on that one.

In the meantime, Sheriff Benton continues to roll the dice and keep all of us in harms way by holding us in his unjustified dangerous game of "Russian Roulette".

In order to get out of this horrible game, the good folks of Natrona County must now band together and move forward to file a "Class Action Lawsuit" against Sheriff Mark Benton "as an individual" for his blatant refusal to protect public safety and local homeland security (subjecting us to possible bodily injury and or death) due to his disregard to not change the NCDC policy that allows un-sober intoxicated suspects back out in the public mainstream.

Sheriff Benton, please do the job we elected for. Step up and protect the masses (us) now. Sort out and worry about the intoxicated suspects (the drunks) rights later. By the way, what is your estimate on the number of drunks you anticipate challenging you about their rights. Also, what is your rationale for placing un-sober inmates’ alleged rights ahead of the public safety of the masses?

Sheriff Benton, think about the risks you’re taking here, inmates’ rights verses potential victim bodily injury or death. You just can't justify prolonging making changes to your un-sober intoxicated suspect bail out policy any longer. Save yourself the hassle and personal expense and just get it done!!!”




"

" Carmen, you know nothing about my or how I feel. I've arrested hundreds of DUI offenders, investigated their accidents, scraped them and their babies off the pavement or out of the bar ditch, and listened the horrific wail of parents after I told them their children are dead from an accident. How dare you presume to know what someone else believes?
But in all that, and now matter how badly I despise drunk driving, I will not allow people like you to tear down the dignity of rule of law to get some quick fix to a complicated problem. You refuse to participate in finding a creative solution that will meets the various players in this drama. Just because the legislature found legal problems with the FIRST idea that was tossed at them you think it's "coddling" drunk drivers? Okay.... "

" TomT, you've shown that you're at least knowledgable on the topic. However, if you know SO much, what's YOUR solution to our "sober release" problem? I just don't understand the logic of how it's a violation of one's constitutional rights? Law enforcement is allowed to "hold" someone for 72 hrs before bringing the person before a court. Even your drunkest of drunks will sober up within 24 hrs, maximum. So, how about making it policy or law for a jail to not take bond for the suspect until showing substantial evidence they're sober? Citizens have a constitutional right for bond...tell me where in the constisution it says the bond cannot be postponed until sobriety? I stepped out and posted my thoughts, now tell me your solution. "

" The problem with the law is that it is illegal to force someone to take a breathalyzer or blood test. In Wyoming YOU DO NOT HAVE TO CONSENT TO A BREATHALYZER or blood test. They can suspend your license for this, but forcing people to take a breath or blood test forces them to produce evidence that can be used against them is illegal. This right is protected by the constitution, it's known as the 5th Amendment. Should we just begin throwing out amendments to the constitution because it affords you a little more safety? Why don't we just throw out our reasonable expectation of privacy (amendment 4) and allow police to randomly search homes and tap phones to search for criminals? We can get rid of that pesky first amendment too, since people spreading ideas freely could lead to bad thoughts... the point of our constitution, the entire point of our country's existence is the fact that ecery citizen has rights. By allowing this bill to pass, we're allowing a precedent to supress other rights in the future. If you want to live in a police state, move to Laos or North Korea. "

" Why do you even bother the cops to pick up drunk drivers if you are going to release them while they are still drunk? This seems like a real stupid thing to do! Every person in the state of Wyoming is in harms way everytime they get on the road if you are not going to make an effort to take care of this problem. "

" I've been saying all along, the quickest and cleanest way to do this is through the Court. In most states the District Judge requires every person arrested for DUI to appear personally before the court when the court is in session. (No pre-set standing bond amount) Since Judges are usually at home in bed when drunks are arrested, the drunks ALL spend the night and sober up before they see the judge in the morning.
It's a simple thing, and it removes the choice from law enforcement and simply tells them what to do.
Anonymous, if you will research the "72 hour hold" you are discussing, you will find that it can only be used narrowly on weekends, and then sparingly. The "Big Court" has ruled that it can be used on weekends or holidays due to courts being closed. It cannot be used for every arrest, or to hold people for a long time. Law enforcement is expected to present arrestees to a court with no delay. (it's in the constitution) so if you begin to hold arrestees for 72 hours for every DUI arrest, you will find yourself in a legal quagmire, probably in litigation.

The real problem here in Wyoming is, we want to continue to treat drunk driving as a simple traffic infraction rather than a horribly irresponsible and deadly crime. We need to be asking our Judges what they can do to require DUI arrestees be held overnight to appear personally before the court. This is easy, there are many charges where there is no standing bond amount where the arrestee MUST be held to see a judge. It's simple, just add drunk driving to this list. Plus, Judges don't have to ask permission... "

" There is no evidence to support the idea that drinking alcohol impairs driving. In fact I've got my bottle of Jim Beam right here in my pickup as I type this message on my iPhone. Is that a train coming at------- "

" There are also many posts of significance interest triggered by this issue logged under the CST article (02/19/08) "Sheriff will revist jail release policy after bill dies" Place the word “Benton” in the search box, hit search and it will lead you to the above article , Find other articles relating to the Irene incident by using the words "Irene", "Pagel", and "Sandbar". You can also view the Affidavits supporting the complaintts filed against D. Downs at http://www.jeffirene.com/
"

" "Where there is no punishment, there will be crime" John F. Kennedy, Profiles in Courage.

This problem is not limited to DUI. It is the very reason that crime has gone through the roof. We collectively no longer have the guts to fully punish people.

Instead, we rationalize and justify away the guilt of individuals and we seek to reduce crime by group punishment via broad, freedom restricting legislation.

All totalitarian governments use broad, restrictive legislation to oppress their citizenry via the removal of freedoms "for their own good." This is the model being most vigorously pushed by the liberal left, the democrats.

Is this what you want? Is this the America that you want for your children?

Remember that the government exists because we allow it to in America, not the other way around.

We are the owners of this nation, don't sell out. With ownerships comes personal responsibility as a citizen. Do you have the moral courage to accept this personal responsibility for your actions and inactions?
"

" Since the Downs incident, how many individuals have been released from the Sheriff after being arrested for drunk driving while still drunk? The way you folks are going on and on, sounds like thousands! "

" Tom T, Its good to see you and ole FED UP back in the saddle again.

Boy that Sheriff Benton really got stomped in the dirt pretty darn hard down here in old Cheyenne City.

Looked like it was a good thing he stayed hiding and didn’t show up to defend himself.

I’m dumb founded that he had the audacity to say that he was disappointed that Senate File 59 was killed. How much more insult does he want to add to the injury?

Had he come out of hiding, it was very apparent that the Statewide Pose wanted to present him with a one way ticket out of town.

It sure is interesting how close “I’M MAD TO EDDIE” called it way back on 01/10/08.

I want to take that guy to Vegas with me the next time I go.

He needs to try his luck on the Lotteries as well.
"